I'll give it to you straight Pelepundit, Budthomas, Linda & Pastel

"Addiction is the only mental disorder that convinces the afflicted that it's everyone else who is ill, not himself. This is because of addictive denial. This is not a conscious act. In the grateful addict's new reality, he realizes that this denial is the unconscious mind's ability to completely block an addict's conscious awareness of the nature of his addictive behavior, and personality, replacing it with vivid misconceptions, created to support the addictive behavior. Positive emotions and motivations are perverted, denied, or extinguished, An individual eventually becomes almost zombie-like, and running on automatic, very unlike his former self."
You can read it in entirety here;
http://www.csun.edu/~vcpsy00h/students/drugs.htm

"The nine most terrifying words in the English language are: 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.'"

Ronald Reagan

And that is by far much worse than all the damage caused by all of these drugs combined.

The U.S. comprises 5 percent of the world's population yet uses 60 percent of the world's drugs. The prohibition on these drugs has been waged for 70 years and has cost $1.5 trillion.

The drug war encompasses everyone of us. The prohibited Drugs kill far less people than the drug war.

The prison system under prohibition worsens both the drug epidemic and the AIDS epidemic.

A potential tax payer is turned into a tax burden every time prison is used to enforce prohibition.

87 percent of drug users are white yet 74 percent of people sentenced for drug possession are black. Whites do most of the 'crime' but blacks do most of the time.

Teachers with a college degree start at around $32,000 annually and a university professor with a Ph.D. starts at around $47,000 annually, but prison guards with a GED or high school diploma earn $50,000 plus overtime pay annually to guard non-violent pot smokers and drug offenders.

Everything you have been told by the government about drugs is a lie; the two proven gateway drugs are already legal: alcohol and nicotine.

Needle-exchange programs are a proven method of limiting the spread of infectious diseases like HIV/AIDS and hepatitis C.

The only thing that has proven to reduce use and demand is treatment and education.

"The only thing that has proven to reduce use and demand is treatment and education."

Are you in favor of reduction of drug use or increase in drug use?

"The nine most terrifying words in the English language are: 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.'"

Ronald Reagan

I am in favor of any policy that provides a positive outcome and that usually means a policy that is evidence based. Prohibition, on the contrary, has been proven to turn peaceful inner cities into civil war zones, and ruin the economy. I consider it therefor my duty to point out to you the fact, that even though your intentions may well be good, the result of your inability to recognize the futility of your actions will just prolong the agony for the rest of us who are effected by this counter-productive and dangerous policy.

I control nothing.

I do see the lack of output and initiative by people that puff the bush. I grew up in southern California as an idealistic surf cat. It was nothing to go into the Surf Theater to catch a classic like "Tales from the tube" and be overwhelmed with the smell of reefer when I walked in the door. This was back in the 70's!!

I have seen these guys grow up and, some, not grow up. Buddy, I have my own empirical evidence. The majority of the guys I knew that enjoyed their bong hits are NOTHINGS. They have nothing, know nothing, and have amounted to nothing!! I have seen friends move off of pot to stronger drugs and lose all semblance of humanity. Dude, you are a boatload of rhetoric!! I'm going by what I have seen and there is a ton of information out there that SUPPORTS it because they have seen the SAME THING!! You know it too.

"The nine most terrifying words in the English language are: 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.'"

Ronald Reagan

and therefor co-responsible for the more than 6,000 Mexicans which were murdered due to YOUR Drug War last year alone. That mega violence is heading this way fast. Re-legalizing/regulating these street drugs is the only way to cut off the enormous flow of cash that is feeding terrorism, gangsterism and "off the scale" government corruption. This is not about facilitating 'dopeheads' pelepundit, so please keep your frustrations to yourself. This is about protecting ourselves and our families.

The present drug laws are making matters far worse than they would ever be under proper government regulation of these dangerous substances. Your support of drug prohibition provides the money gangs use to buy guns, and the money that the enemies of this great nation use to finance hijackings & bombings. Taking away their drug money by regulating drugs for adult use will strike a blow to crime at every level. This is none other than sound public policy.

Surely you know by now Pelepundit that Eliot Ness never put the bootleggers out of business. Repeal and a regulated market for alcohol did that in short order. There hasn't been a shootout over beer routes since 1933.

It’s time Pelepundit for you to wise up, and help curtail the dangerous expansions of federal police powers, the encroachments on individual liberties, the increasing government expenditure devoted to enforcing the unworkable drug laws.

Or would you prefer to still struggle with confusing the consequences of drug misuse from those of drug prohibition, while we all go to hell in a hand cart? All of the above mentioned problems, including the economic recession are here to stay until we regulate drugs, and prohibition is not regulation, it's is a hideous waking nightmare for all of us and our families.

Alcohol prohibition, was a tremendous failure due to the incredible amount of crime and disorder it created. Human nature hasn't changed since the 1930s. Then, the distribution of liquor was turned over to a whole new group of criminal entrepreneurs. Now, due to the current drug war, dangerous mind altering substances are sold, unregulated, by another new criminal class. The drug war has turned most of the inner cities into civil war zones, so our intentions in prohibiting these substances may well be good, but the result of our inability to recognize the futility of such an action will just both deepen and prolong the agony caused by this useless and dangerous policy.

The future depends on whether or not enough of us are willing to take a long look at the tragic results of prohibition. If we continue to skirt the primary issue while refusing to address the root problem, then we can expect no other result than a worsening of the current dire situation. Good intentions are no match for the immutable realities of human nature.

So let's have some realism from you now on how to go about reclaiming both the streets, and the economy. Make an honest effort to address the root cause of the present economic mess and the high proliferation of "well funded" violent gangs: the regime of drug prohibition.

Again Malcolm, here's the thing that I seriously don't (nor will) understand. Why is this issue just SO pressing for you? Why do you think that discussion after discussion is going to result in on the hive? Don't you think that if you REALLY wanted to make a difference and allow the people to be 'free' to pick up crack and crystal meth at the local walmart, that you should be speaking and presenting to law makers? Or at least a large crowd that actually cares about this...?

Seriously, take a look at most of your posts over the past few years and they're ALL somehow related (or directly) to legalizing pot. Dude, all I have to say is that if this consumes ALL your time, you have an addiction problem...

BT

"All of you are complicit in death, despair and crime by gifting the illegal drug market to terror groups, paramilitaries and organised criminals. You contribute to the political and economic destabilization of producer and transit countries and put millions at risk of contracting blood-borne viruses. Your position on prohibition poses a greater threat to global well-being than the drugs themselves."

I do enjoy the engaging debate with malcolmkyle, I'll give him props on that.
But I agree with you BT, the question is why??

"The nine most terrifying words in the English language are: 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.'"

Ronald Reagan

Could that be the answer.

Or does the sock smell familar?

Maybe you should sit under a tree out of the sun and wait for the fog to roll in.

Is that you Malcom82??

"The nine most terrifying words in the English language are: 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.'"

Ronald Reagan

less punitive pot laws have lower rates of use. Like the Netherlands...

The global illegal drug market makes up about 8% of total annual global trade, an amount that is around $500 billion per year.

Mexico's cartels (more accurately DTOs - Drug Trafficking Organizations) alone process between $30 - $100 billion a year from the drug trade. We expect our piddly $400 million to Mexico to stop that?

Ok... and please, I've asked Linda (Activist1) this too many times to count and so far she hasn't and seemingly won't, but please demonstrate the successes of drugs Prohibition. Are drugs less available? Are they pure? Are they cheaper? No, no, and no...

Hell folks, we can't even keep drugs out of our jails and prisons even tho' they are surrounded with barbed wire, armed security and video surveillance.

---
“Prohibition? HA! They tried that in the movies and it didn't work”

~ Homer Simpson

ae's Morning Donut

If your not capable of separating the damage that a drug user does to himself, and the extra harm the policy of prohibition does to all of us, then I'm afraid you're definitely not capable of understanding what motivates a person as myself to devote so much time and energy to this problem.

1919-1933 was a bloody era of violence and killings that started to decline only when the Volstead Act was finally repealed.

Why was it ever enacted? Because the first feminist movement in the United States, the Women's Temperance Union, bolstered by church and other social engineering movements argued correctly that alcohol was extremely addictive and led to family distress, unemployment and violence against women and children.

In 1923 the executive council of the American Federation of Labor issued an address to the American people after an exhaustive investigation of the effects of the Volstead Act. It was shown by this investigation that there had been–––

A general disregard of the law among all classes of people, including those who made the law.

Creation of thousands of moonshiners among both country and city dwellers.

The creation of an army of bootleggers.

An amazing increase in the traffic in poisons and deadly concoctions and drugs.

An increased rate of insanity, blindness, and crime among the users of these concoctions and drugs.

Increase in taxes to city, State, and National Government amounting to approximately $1,000,000,000 per year.

THE NATIONAL PROHIBITION LAW HEARINGS
April 5 to 24, 1926

Since prohibition was repealed, there have still been problems with alcohol addiction along with associated health issues, but the vast majority of people's drinking has not led to the downfall of society. If we can handle the regulation of alcohol, one of the most powerful, addictive and dangerous of drugs, we can handle just about anything, and that includes cocaine and amphetamines.

And everything is readily available right now out there to all of us anyway; drugs of all varieties are cheap and plentiful, and the basic economics of drug dealing remain: Take one dealer off the street, and another takes his place. Something that simply doesn't happen for other more real crimes, such as murder, embezzlement or burglary.

Historically, the prohibition of any mind altering substance has never succeeded in providing what is needed, which is a safer environment for the addict, the family and society at large. It always has, and always will, spawn far worse conditions than those it claims to be able to alleviate.

Thanks again for all the quality information. With some, I am afraid you may as well be talking to a box of rocks. Actually, I think you are in this case.

"Follow the path of the unsafe, independent thinker. Expose your ideas to the danger of controversy. Speak your mind and fear less the label of crackpot than the stigma of conformity." - Thomas J. Watson

Lot's of quality information simpson! Now you must feel better about sparking your crystal meth pipe!

What a confidence booster eh?

LOL

the vacuous posts only align you closer with Miz Linda. Ya got anythin' else to add? No rebuttal? No demonstration of your beloved Prohibition's successes?

---
“Prohibition? HA! They tried that in the movies and it didn't work”

~ Homer Simpson

ae's Morning Donut

Did alcohol and found it to be the worst of all for me. But I never even puffed a Joint or done any illegal street drugs. None. Zero. But I would legalize all of them for the reasons you have been told over and over and over.

"Follow the path of the unsafe, independent thinker. Expose your ideas to the danger of controversy. Speak your mind and fear less the label of crackpot than the stigma of conformity." - Thomas J. Watson

--malcolm wrote--------
If your not capable of separating the damage that a drug user does to himself, and the extra harm the policy of prohibition does to all of us, then I'm afraid you're definitely not capable of understanding what motivates a person as myself to devote so much time and energy to this problem.
-----------end---------

Let me put it this way Malcolm...WHO is going to take care of all the rehab for these druggies that harm themselves?? Lemme guess.....the US government right?

of course since everything is 'legalized' and druggies are willing to claim INCOME on all the transactions, these are the fees that will pay, right? Please don't tell me that this is what you think...

BT

Your bottomless sack of red-hearings and vacuous flitting about does indeed do nothing but remind us all of Activist/Linda's inane behavior.

I seem to recall you recently claiming, that you once had a substance-addiction Bud. Would you now care to explain to us, how on earth, despite prohibition, you were easily able to procure your drug or drugs of choice? Allow me to answer that for you Bud: Everything you needed was freely available to you because prohibition is incapable of nullifying the immutable laws of supply and demand.

Bud, the amount of people willing to be conned by a bunch of self serving bureaucrats into unwittingly lending their support to this failed policy is dwindling fast. Nobody wants another four more decades of steady losing.

Wake up, wise up and face facts!

You keep it real. You want to see legalization of your "drug of choice". And your arguments are consistent. I respect that, but still do not support your position. Such makes great debate.

malcolmkyle- Help! You don't do drugs, you are merely a foot-soldier in the fight against "prohibition" against pot (or is it all illegal drugs?) saying that we would be better off if they were all legal like alcohol? You are doing this to "protect your family".
But why is the whole world working towards the eradication of drugs and the drug culture if there are so many positives?? The whole world is in sync with "prohibition".
Are you out to make your case against all governments or just ours??

You are a just a fish in a very, very large sea brother.

"The nine most terrifying words in the English language are: 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.'"

Ronald Reagan

Obama Should Push For Drug Legalization

Legalize Drugs To Break State's Prison Dependency

ON THE BORDER, A CRISIS ESCALATES

THE WAR ON DRUGS IS A FAILURE

It Just Makes Sense To End The War On Drugs

Editorial: Head of Drug Council Should Bring Change

Column: Drug Policy Will Liken Loosen

Missouri Drug Policy Reform Conference Pushes For Change

Educator Calls for Debate on Prohibition

Legalize Drugs To Break State's Prison Dependency

Former Colorado Cop Advocates For Legalization Of Drugs

Legalization Would Help 'Control' Drugs

Church Awaits Ruling On Use Of Hallucinogens

This is just a small sample from the last 5 days and they are not simply letters to the editor; the battle's over Pele, now go home, and take good care of your family!

God Bless you!

Great headlines. They are all from The "Media Awareness Project" which is a pro drug activist group. It constantly solicits its members to "send us newspaper articles related to illicit drugs and illicit drug policy for placement in our Drugnews Archive"

The "Church" mentioned in the headline you sited from the Media Awareness Project is an off-shoot of a Brazilian church in Ashland, Oregon. That is about as close to Haight Ashbury as you will get this side of the "psychedelic 60's", although the headline makes it look like it might be a legitimate church.

Not really anybodies version of "Mainstreet USA"
If I looked any closer I might have seen stories that you plagiarized. You're hopeless.

I'm not sure what you're swimming in. I think I might have stepped in it once when I visited a dairy.

"The nine most terrifying words in the English language are: 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.'"

Ronald Reagan

amigo. The Media Awareness Project operates the DrugNews archive. It is a LIBRARY! A library of drug policy related articles. Pro and con. I am a volunteer for MAP and have been for over a decade. The DrugNews archive contains over 200,000 articles - news, opinions, letters-to-the-editor.

A few years back, the ONDCP (Office of No Drug Control Policy) tried their own version and after 2 years had about 800 articles - with their approved slant - and they used paid employees. Our purpose at MAP is to provide information, to allow people to educate THEMSELVES so they approach the subject from an informed position. All articles posted are from very REAL newspapers and magazines. They are not "our" articles. Again, Pele, you have an obvious bias showing... and it would pay to know that of which you speak.

The MAP archive is a monumental accomplishment with no equal. And it was done on the backs of lots of volunteers like myself. Your statement:

"They are all from The "Media Awareness Project" which is a pro drug activist group."

... sounds oh-so-much like Miz Linda. You really need to learn that anti-Prohibition does not equal "pro-drug." It is a tired and overworked, and very inaccurate portrayal.

Ya know Pele... it sounds a lot like YOU have some anti-drug organizational affiliation, so... do you?

---
“Prohibition? HA! They tried that in the movies and it didn't work”

~ Homer Simpson

ae's Morning Donut

I usually supply the media Awareness Project links because the direct links to newspaper articles eventually time-out. Anyway, here they all are again, but this time with the direct link. I know you'll not reply to us on this, but at least the other readers can see that we do not make anything up.

Obama Should Push For Drug Legalization

Legalize Drugs To Break State's Prison Dependency

ON THE BORDER, A CRISIS ESCALATES

THE WAR ON DRUGS IS A FAILURE

It Just Makes Sense To End The War On Drugs

Editorial: Head of Drug Council Should Bring Change

Column: Drug Policy Will Liken Loosen

Missouri Drug Policy Reform Conference Pushes For Change

Educator Calls for Debate on Prohibition

Legalize Drugs To Break State's Prison Dependency

Former Colorado Cop Advocates For Legalization Of Drugs

Legalization Would Help 'Control' Drugs

Church Awaits Ruling On Use Of Hallucinogens

The significance of the last article is to show that there is already a legal and accepted use to some hallucinogenics. -Go ahead, challenge me on this!

So as I said above; this was just a small sample from those 5 days and they were not simply letters to the editor; the battle's truly over Linda/Pele/Budthomas, now wise up to it!

If something normal happens. "Teen goes to school, comes home and does homework", "Husband of twentysomething wife commutes to work". The normal things in life will never be a headline story. I know these two examples are abstract, but seriously, you can find extreme headlines anywhere, that's why they're headlines. They Pique interest and sell papers.

OK, I'll try you. I am assuming, ae, that you also look for headlines that support the position of drug enforcement policies. After all, you aren't reporting these things with any bias are you??

By the way fellas, I heard a recent news story citing illegal (Those are the ones they have laws against using, in case you missed it) drug use is declining among youth. But they are seeing in increase , among youth, with the misuse of prescription drugs. Hmmm. No prohibition on those, is there?

It sounds like the story here is, if you want less usage, make it illegal, and if you want more usage, prescribe it. Hmmmm. Bucks your theory.

"The nine most terrifying words in the English language are: 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.'"

Ronald Reagan

A link please.

Huffington post headline

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/02/03/marijuana-use-down-among-_n_163516.html

"The United States ranked third in 2006, with 24 percent of boys and
girls each reporting marijuana use. That was down almost 12 percent
among boys and 2 percent among girls, echoing previous reports of
declining pot use among U.S. teens."

Here's USA Today

http://www.usatoday.com/news/health/2007-12-11-teens-drugs_N.htm

Here's some more;

http://www.mpp.org/states/district-of-columbia/news/illegal-drug-use-down-among.html

http://news.google.com/news?q=drug+use+down+among+teens&oe=utf-8&rls=com.yahoo:en-US:official&client=firefox&um=1&ie=UTF-8&hl=en&ei=KbipSbm-J5qqtQP1rqT3Dw&sa=X&oi=news_result&resnum=11&ct=title

And in case the words are too big you can watch this;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kOkvNyeNTM0

"The nine most terrifying words in the English language are: 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.'"

Ronald Reagan

you started off as if you were a reasonable person. You knock the articles we post as being from some insidious underground "movement" yet when it is pointed out to you that these are real world newspaper articles, you fail to respond. And no, unlike your f'ing ONDCP, we don't just seek out supporting articles. We want both sides to be heard, that is the point.

And what about those racist roots for your drug war's founding laws? Eh?

Oh, and which anti-drug group are you here representing?

---
“Prohibition? HA! They tried that in the movies and it didn't work”

~ Homer Simpson

ae's Morning Donut

us smot pokers who understand Prohibition has failed. From the LA Times:

US CA: Editorial: A No-Win 'War On Drugs'

The Current Strategy Isn't Working. We Need an Open Discussion About What's Next.

It is in this context that the Latin American Commission on Drugs and Democracy, convened by three former presidents, has called on the U.S. to end the "war." Among other suggestions, former presidents Ernesto Zedillo of Mexico, Fernando Henrique Cardoso of Brazil and Cesar Gaviria of Colombia urge the U.S. to evaluate the public policy and medicinal merits of decriminalizing marijuana for personal possession.

Those of us who oppose the drug war are not just on the fringes of society, we are from all walks of life, all cultural and economic levels of society. George Schultz, former Sec of State for instance, is strongly opposed to his war at home. The late conservative columnist Wm F Buckley is another.

---
“Prohibition? HA! They tried that in the movies and it didn't work”

~ Homer Simpson

ae's Morning Donut

"Reason" has nothing to do with your view of the world.... at least be honest about it.

 Maybe the new guy "Rational Voice " will chirp in about now.

 Sock puppets.... my goodness. If all else fails, invent an alter ego? Yep, someone's been smoking something.

_________________________

Denial ain't just a river in Egypt.

reasoned, experienced voices you are left with nothing but epithats, again...

---
“Prohibition? HA! They tried that in the movies and it didn't work”

~ Homer Simpson

ae's Morning Donut

now thats funny...

to read your link (which I do to try to remainfair to your argument). You must have missed this paragraph (Which is why we need to find a new way to combat the drug culture)

"Such decriminalization ( which isn't the same as legalization; it
would be OK to hold small amounts of marijuana for personal use, but
sale and distribution would still be illegal ) might solve some
problems but exacerbate others.  It could, for example, encourage more
young people to begin using drugs.  And though marijuana doesn't cause
anywhere near the number of deaths of tobacco and alcohol, it is a
gateway drug to more dangerous substances, and its decriminalization
could worsen the impact of drugs on our communities. "

"

"The nine most terrifying words in the English language are: 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.'"

Ronald Reagan

to read your link (which I do to try to remainfair to your argument). You must have missed this paragraph (Which is why we need to find a new way to combat the drug culture)

"Such decriminalization ( which isn't the same as legalization; it
would be OK to hold small amounts of marijuana for personal use, but
sale and distribution would still be illegal ) might solve some
problems but exacerbate others.  It could, for example, encourage more
young people to begin using drugs.  And though marijuana doesn't cause
anywhere near the number of deaths of tobacco and alcohol, it is a
gateway drug to more dangerous substances, and its decriminalization
could worsen the impact of drugs on our communities. "

"

"The nine most terrifying words in the English language are: 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.'"

Ronald Reagan

You should try and keep up!

Obama Should Push For Drug Legalization

Legalize Drugs To Break State's Prison Dependency

ON THE BORDER, A CRISIS ESCALATES

THE WAR ON DRUGS IS A FAILURE

It Just Makes Sense To End The War On Drugs

Editorial: Head of Drug Council Should Bring Change

Column: Drug Policy Will Liken Loosen

Missouri Drug Policy Reform Conference Pushes For Change

Educator Calls for Debate on Prohibition

Legalize Drugs To Break State's Prison Dependency

Former Colorado Cop Advocates For Legalization Of Drugs

Legalization Would Help 'Control' Drugs

During Alcohol Prohibition personal use and possession were never criminalized but it still caused the same dire problems we see today with it's modern counterpart. That's why it eventually inspired poster campaigns like this one:

"The sources you cite are all nut job pro pot groups."

I've explained this before. Last time... MAP's DrugNews archive is just that, an archive of published articles from papers and mags all over the world. Over 200,000 articles. It is a LIBRARY. Simple as that. And it is respected for what it is. We know it is used by both sides, because WE include BOTH sides.

And dude... your tone keeps getting nastier... and nastier...

---
“Prohibition? HA! They tried that in the movies and it didn't work”

~ Homer Simpson

ae's Morning Donut

This is but a small portion of the topic, but just so you will know, there is no such thing as a "gateway" drug.

"Follow the path of the unsafe, independent thinker. Expose your ideas to the danger of controversy. Speak your mind and fear less the label of crackpot than the stigma of conformity." - Thomas J. Watson

I purpously supplied the same media Awareness Project links and you reacted to them exactly the same as the first time. Have you already forgotten, that after your first ignorant reaction, I took the trouble to prove to you that they were real newspaper articles by providing the direct links to the said same articles -17 posts above this one. You blatantly ignored this and I expect you to react no differently this time. Here again for the benefit of all the other readers are those same direct links.

Obama Should Push For Drug Legalization

Legalize Drugs To Break State's Prison Dependency

ON THE BORDER, A CRISIS ESCALATES

THE WAR ON DRUGS IS A FAILURE

It Just Makes Sense To End The War On Drugs

Editorial: Head of Drug Council Should Bring Change

Column: Drug Policy Will Liken Loosen

Missouri Drug Policy Reform Conference Pushes For Change

Educator Calls for Debate on Prohibition

Legalize Drugs To Break State's Prison Dependency

Former Colorado Cop Advocates For Legalization Of Drugs

Legalization Would Help 'Control' Drugs

So, again as I said above, this was just a small sample from those 5 days and they were not simply letters to the editor; what on earth are you gaining by this except public humiliation PastelPundit?

Drug use and addiction, along with crime, violence and corruption only began to climb after the advent of drug prohibition in 1914. At that time the typical opium user was a silver-haired grandmother who kept a bottle of Dr. Kilmer's Swamp Root kidney, liver and bladder cure in her medicine cabinet.

The least you can do is admit defeat! Hopefully you'll decide to think things through better in future. Prohibition paradoxically creates an illicit market which makes drugs which have potential for harm widely available. The harmfulness of some drugs is a central reason to regulate and control these substances.